( SNUG 05 Item 18 ) ---------------------------------------------- [12/20/05]
Subject: NanoSim vs. Nassda HSIM vs. UltraSIM; HSPICE vs. Spectre vs. Eldo
SYNOPSYS CLEANS UP -- Pretty much, Synopsys monopolized the "Fast SPICE"
market the moment they sued-and-then-acquired Nassda:
Synopsys NanoSim: ######################## 59%
Synopsys Nassda HSIM: ###################### 56%
Cadence UltraSim: ##### 13%
Mentor Mach TA: ## 5%
But in "Traditional SPICE", Synopsys (Avanti) is just one of the crowd:
Avanti HSPICE: ####################### 58%
Cadence Spectre: ################ 40%
Mentor Eldo: ############### 37%
Silvaco SmartSpice: #### 9%
Notice in the user comments below how all these different SPICE tools are
used mix-and-match and in specialized situations. Oy! The other thing is
to see how many users use both NanoSim and HSIM; plus there's a mess of
people concerned about how Synopsys will finalize these 2 tools futures.
---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----
Cadence Spectre, have no other tool to compare against.
- Brendan Barry of S3 Ltd.
Nanosim: good for transistor level simulation of digital circuits (not
much analog features), bad at analog transistor level simulation.
HSIM: good for Flash design, exclusively used in this area.
Spectre, Eldo: analog mixed-signal and RF simulation, matter of taste
not performance/ features
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
For Speed: Nanosim, HSIM, Eldo, Spectre, HSPICE
For Precision: HSPICE, Spectre, Eldo, Nanosim, HSIM.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We have all of those! I would say they are all interchangeable.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Eldo is the most used in my company and we are quite satisfied for
accurate simulations. For fast SPICE we use HSIM and NanoSim.
Unfortunately there is no a unique best solution. It really depends
on your kind of design.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use NanoSim a bit, mostly for it's ability to interface with VCS.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Spectre is the tool of choice for analog design. Nanosim and HSIM are
neck and neck in full chip simulation. It's a toss up.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Nassda HSIM and right now the performance and capacity falls short of
our design needs. I am very concerned bout it's future now after being
acquired by Synopsys.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We used Nassda HSIM, but fear Synopsys will make it too expensive to own.
- John Schritz of Tektronix
use Nassda but now that Synopsys purchased them and raised the maintenance
double we are having second thought.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use HSIM and HSPICE. HSIM is #1 for fast SPICE accuracy/speed.
Need HSPICE for critical analog analysis. Hope Synopsys does not screw
up HSIM with the acquisition changes.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Mentor Eldo beats the others for multi-million gate SOC's/SIP's with
multiple analog cores.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Eldo, primarily. I don't have enough data to give any detailed
comparison, but Eldo is sufficient.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Using Eldo for a long time, really satisfied.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use Eldo/Eldo-RF/ADMS. It is not comparable to Nassda or Nanosim.
Eldo fits better with our flow than Spectre, and seems to have a more
open architecture. Also Eldo-RF has harmonic balance, which Spectre
doesn't have (or at least didn't when we evaluated it)
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use Eldo. Do point in comparing NanoSim and HSIM against Spectre and
Eldo. We haven't tested the speed simulators (Nassda and Nanosim). We
chose Eldo over Spectre due to more experience, less closed interfaces,
and a better deal.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Nanosim is fast and more general purpose than HSIM. I find HSIM is best
suited to repeated structures like memories. Nanosim is better for ADCs,
larger general analog systems.
HSPICE is still the standard for a basic spice engine. The cost/benefit
for this tool is high (i.e. it has reasonably good performance for cost).
Eldo is consistently 2x faster than HSPICE. A good tool, but in general
designers are less familiar with it. Most analog guys here run Eldo in
"HSPICE compatibility" mode. Some advancements that were previously only
available in Eldo have recently trickled down into HSPICE (like DC-offset
analysis). This continues to make HSPICE attractive.
Haven't used Spectre in years, so can't comment on that tool.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use NanoSim, Eldo, Spectre-RF.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Use NanoSim, no idea about how it ranks. :)
- Are Arseth of Atmel
Silvaco Smartspice #1
HSPICE
HSIM
Nanosim
Spectre #5
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
rank NanoSim and HSIM, HSIM, then Nanosim
HSPICE, then Spectre
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Recently starting using NanoSim. It was the connection with VCS
that made the sale.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Nanosim and HSPICE. We eval'd HSIM and ended up sticking with Nanosim.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Only use HSPICE and NanoSim. Seem OK
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Use HSPICE and Nanosim.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
They serve different needs. HSIM for memories, Spectre & Eldo good at
RF and in-house spice-like for most.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
HSPICE (1) and NanoSim (2)
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
HSPICE > Nanosim > Spectre > HSIM > Eldo
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
HSPICE because it lets us to share with our customers (common encryption).
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use NanoSim and HSIM. Most groups do fine with NanoSim but for some
of the embedded memories HSIM is a must. We use an internal developed
tool for SPICE which is much preferred over HSPICE.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Mixed cell designers loves Spectre and HSIM. Package application guy
likes HSPICE. Library guy needs NanoSim to create .lib library. I'm
asking everyone to use same tool to reduce the cost of these tools but
it did not work. Now I have to ask Synopsys to drop HSIM quickly from
their product line up.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
HSIM is more accurate but a little slower. Spectre generally converges
better than HSPICE but it's getting closer. Never used Eldo.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use HSPICE and are trying to move to Cadence Spectre
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use Spectre and like it. We experienced HSPICE convergence issues
in the past.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We are using HSPICE and HSIM. We like HSIM but still use HSPICE when we
need accuracy.
- Wanhao Li of Zoran
1. HSIM, 2. NanoSim
1. Spectre, 2. Eldo, 3. HSPICE
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
Successfully used HSIM before, but the company switched to a different
set of tools. Use Spectre and NanoSim. Spectre is good for small
blocks. For anything bigger we need to use Nanosim.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use HSPICE - most of our customers also have it and use HSPICE
for board level signal integrity analysis.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use HSPICE and also Silvaco SmartSpice. I think our analog team
prefers SmartSpice.
- Tom Mannos of Sandia National Laboratories
We use Silvaco SmSPICE. I think it is the best tool and has wide
acceptance now. We also contract out NanoSim work occasionally. HSPICE
is as good as Silvaco with better hard documentation, but is much more
expensive.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
You missed Cadence Ultrasim. Very powerful.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
We use Spectre & Eldo.
We tested NanoSim vs. Nassda vs. UltraSim (Cadence) some time ago.
NanoSim fit hour needs best at that time, so we use it. But UltraSim
has catched up since then, so we are using it, too. My impression is
that the type of circuit and/or application (digital, MS, analog, rf)
can heavily influence the choice of simulator.
- [ An Anon Engineer ]
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