( ESNUG 585 Item 2 ) ---------------------------------------------- [11/20/18]
Subject: Costello on SNPS PnR "still in catch up mode" in 2 years from now
DAC'18 Troublemakers Panel in San Francisco
Cooley: [To Anirudh] Your Cadence Genus RTL did really well in the
Best of 2017 survey results, where you were going up against
the Synopsys Design Compiler RTL synthesis monopoly.
Best of 2017: Genus RTL synthesis gaining traction vs. DC
But Genus only did well because it was teamed up inside a CDNS
Innovus PnR flow. (ESNUG 582 #1) That's a very different
battle than trying to do a full point tool, take-straight-on
play. So, I get it. You're winning in Innovus -- and you
want to expand the use Genus RTL with that.
BACKGROUND FOR THE UPCOMING QUESTION:
"I don't know what the exact numbers are, but Synopsys
laid off 200 people between 55-60 years old. So, they
cleaned house of everybody in the prior generation.
So, how long does it take that new IC Compiler II
generation to get on their feet and start being
productive and potentially challenge Anirudh for
the lead?
In my experience, writing a place and route system
takes 3 to 4 years. We're not going to know if Synopsys
has a good team or not for 3 or 4 years."
- Jim Hogan in DAC'17 Troublemakers Panel
My question is... blah blah blah Innovus and Design Compiler,
or IC Compiler II -- where Aart did a massive layoff of his
people -- we talked about it last year.
Why I ask this is, does this mean you at Cadence only have a
golden period of like 24 months -- and then you're in trouble
Anirudh? Your position is going to be reversed with Aart's?
Costello: [To Anirudh] It's alright. I'll give you a job in 3 years.
(laughter)
Cooley: [To Anirudh] The advantage you have is you have a PnR tool,
Innovus, that's really working well. And you, Cadence, did
a re-org back in 2012 (ESNUG 534 #4) so you're reaping the
benefits of that now. Aart did a massive re-org last year.
(ESNUG 579 #2) Are you going to be in trouble in 2020?
Anirudh: So that's not how I think, or that's not how we at Cadence
think ... you know, John, just like you asked me last year,
there's "new chip, old chip". It's not like a new re-org,
old re-org, you know... it's not as simple as that.
The simple thing I ask myself is: "Do you have the best team?
Do you have the best technology? Are you working with the
right customers and partners?"
And I believe we are. The way we look at it is not about
re-orgs. Of course, we track what our competitors are doing;
but I ask how far are we from optimal or ideal? I think our
Innovus can still improve. Genus can still improve. These
tools can work well together. And we are very confident in
our road map going forward.
So that's how we drive ourselves. Yes, there are other people
in the market (Aart and Wally). It's a competitive market.
"But how much can we keep improving our tools and provide
better solutions to our customers?" is what drives Cadence.
Costello: I'll make a comment about it. You know, Aart will be lucky
if he's in that mode in two years of giving Anirudh's PnR job
security a problem.
Because we forget sometimes, these are really hard problems and
when you actually pull together a team, you know a large team,
with the diverse skills to actually solve these problems -- you
know it's not quite a miracle -- but it's a work of art to make
that happen.
And it's not a guarantee that you're going to be able to do it.
So I hope for Aart's company that he's able to do that -- but
it's not a guarantee that he can make it happen.
The second thing is I doubt there will be that much trouble
because I don't think there's a real phase shift going on at
that time, [2 years from now] too, so [Aart] will still be in
catch up mode. I mean that's the cycle that goes on...
Cooley: Yeah, Anirudh had an advantage of a tech opening going on for
him -- because ICC 2 failed, it flopped and...
Costello: And that happens. So Aart won't probably won't get that same
impetus like where there's that phase change going on.
But on the other hand, it's important [for Anirudh and Aart]
to chase the next node -- because that's where the hard problems
are that you've got to solve. Someone's got to solve it and
that's where the opening is, every single time.
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