( ESNUG 481 Item 1 ) -------------------------------------------- [05/08/09]
Subject: ( ESNUG 480 #3 ) Cooley told "Don't drink the Synopsys Kool-Aid"
> Why do leading edge semiconductor companies such as Broadcom choose the
> best-in-class point tools? Because it lets them execute better and get
> their chips out the door faster. The so-called "Frankenstein flow" is a
> fallacy - industry standard interfaces let users integrate their point
> tool flows seamlessly and quickly - we do it every day. In most cases
> the best-in-class flows are better integrated than the bundled flow.
>
> - Eric Thune
> AtopTech, Inc. Santa Clara, CA
From: Jeff Echtenkamp <echtenka=user domain=broadcom.com>
Hi, John,
Was reading your interesting email chat with Eric.
An interesting point I would make, although Eric singles us (Broadcom) out
as using the best-in-class tools, I'm curious how many people actually use
a similar approach. There are few tools in EDA which have a high market
share. Let's look at the Big Four's tools, any monopolies, and the viable
alternatives in each niche.
1) Functional Verification
Duopoly - Synopsys Vera and Cadence SpecMan "e"
2) Formal Verification
Alternatives - Jasper, Mentor 0-In, Synopsys Magellan,
Cadence IFV, Real Intent
3) RTL Simulation
Triopoloy - Mentor ModelSim, Cadence NC-Sim, Synopsys VCS
4) RTL Synthesis
Monopoly - Synopsys Design Compiler
Alternatives - Cadence RTL Compiler, Magma BlastRTL, OAsys
5) Equivalence Checking
Duopoly - Cadence Verplex and Synopsys Formality
6) Test/ATPG/Scan/BIST
Duopoly - Mentor FastScan/DFT Advisor and Synopsys TetraMax
7) Floorplanning
Semi-monopoly - Cadence First Encounter
Alternatives: Magma Hydra, Synopsys Jupiter, Atoptech Apogee
8) Place and Route
Triopoloy - Synopsys ICC, Magma Talus, Cadence Encounter
Alternatives - Atoptech, Mentor Sierra
9) RC Extraction
Duopoly - Synopsys Star-RCXT and Cadence Fire&Ice
Alternatives - Mentor Calibre-xRC, Magma QuartzRC, Sequence Columbus
10) Static Timing
Monopoly - Synopsys PrimeTime
Alternatives - Cadence ETS, Extreme GoldTime, Incentia TimeCraft,
CLK-DA Amber, Magma QuartzTime
11) Signal Integrity
Duopoly - Synopsys PT-SI and Cadence CeltIC
Alternatives - Extreme GoldTime, Incentia TimeCraft, CLK-DA Amber
12) IR Analysis
Semi-monopoly - Apache Redhawk
Alternatives - Cadence VoltageStorm
13) DRC/LVS
Monopoly - Mentor Calibre
Alternatives - Synopsys Hercules, Magma Quartz
14) SPICE
Alternatives - Synopsys HSIM/HSPICE, Cadence Spectre, Magma
FineSim, Mentor, Nascentric, Berkeley
15) Full Custom
Monopoly - Cadence Virtuoso
Alternatives - SpringSoft Laker, Magma Titan, Synopsys Orion
16) FPGA
Duopoly - Mentor Exemplar and Synopsys Synplicity
Alternatives - tools from Xilinx and Altera
17) Emulators/Acceletors
Monopoly - Cadence Palladium
Alternatives - Mentor Veloce, EVE, Dini, Synopsys HAPS
OK, so if I go "all Synopsys"... this typically means I'm still an Apache,
Mentor Calibre, and Cadence Verplex customer. Not to mention MENT or SNPS
for FPGA and Cadence for Palladium and Virtuoso.
If I go "all Cadence"... typically means I'm still use Synopsys PrimeTime
and DC, Mentor Calibre & FastScan. Not to mention MENT or SNPS for FPGA.
If I go "all Magma"... typically means I use SNPS, CDNS, MENT, and Apache,
for the tools LAVA doesn't have or for what it's not best-in-class in.
I'd be curious to hear if any large semi company is honestly using either
an all-Cadence or an all-Synopsys flow just for SOC implementation. They
might have an official all-you-can-eat deal, but just because they can eat
it, doesn't mean they won't choose something more tasty.
I'm guessing a 3-4 company "mix and match" flow is much more common than
not, given Calibre and Redhawk's marketshare.
- Jeff Echtenkamp
Broadcom Corporation Irvine, CA
---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----
> There's a reason why Synopsys is scrambling to become everyone's "Primary
> EDA Vendor"; it's the same reason why Microsoft has done so well. Having
> a monopoly means having a sweet, sweet life. Just ask Bill Gates.
>
> - John Cooley of DeepChip.com
From: [ The Muffin Man ]
Hi, John,
I can't believe you fell for the Synopsys Marketing "Primary EDA Partner"
campaign. It's BS fabrication. Users get deep discounts on the Synopsys
tools that they already use in exchange for signing off on a press release.
The engineers at Marvell, LSI, Tundra, Sanyo, Matsishita, and Intel all
still use the same mix of Cadence, Mentor, and Magma in conjunction with
Synopsys that they used before. Nothing has changed.
You're getting rusty. You should have seen through this.
- [ The Muffin Man ]
---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----
From: [ El Dorado ]
Hi, John,
You should take your own advice. Don't drink the Synopsys Kool-Aid. We
still use the best-in-class mix of point tools we've always used. TTM is
what drives my boss' boss' boss. Eric is right. In every case we've seen,
best-in-class flows are better integrated than the bundled flows.
- [ El Dorado ]
---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----
From: [ Dr. Venture ]
Hi, John,
You might want to ask the kind folks at Freescale how that Cadence package
deal worked out for them. LOL!
- [ Dr. Venture ]
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